August 25, 2012
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Simplicity
For the unemployment rate to have fallen to “only” 8.2% (historically one of the highest rates ever). The labor department needs to say that 4.9 Million workers who used to exist, no longer exist, all while the US population is growing at a rate of about 200,000 every month. According to Obama they are not unemployed anymore. No they have been abducted by aliens and are no longer on this planet.
When a tax rate is at a certain level for 10 years. That is no longer a tax cut, it is the existing tax rate. If you keep calling our existing tax rates the “Bush tax cuts” you are a moron. I say lets undo the Reagan tax cuts, but first lets go after the Kennedy tax cuts. Do not be stupid people, its called a tax increase, the fact that they vote on these tax rates every two years does not change a thing.
For those of you who think we can tax the rich and that will fix the dept that was created by Obama’s massive increases in federal spending. If we tax the top 10% of the US population at a rate of 100% and take all they own. We can not only reduce the deficit to zero but we can also pay off the entire national dept. But enjoy that one year because you just bankrupted the people who pay 71% of all taxes. It will be a great one year but the government will need to cut itself by 2/3 after that.
Comments (49)
Liberal logic is anti logic.
I was never considered unemployed, but I was. I didn’t collect benefits because I had money.
In other words, by taxing the rich, we doom ourselves to bankruptcy? Sorry, what I mean to say is, I wish you could write more often. I don’t really care about details, but I always see your point. Using my imagination I can deduce that, our population growth will consume more resources. Well it’s not my problem, and what are you going to do about it?
@RulerofMasons - No, but we can not balence the budget on the backs of the top 10%, let alone what many fools think by increasing taxes on the top 2%.
You are actually incorrect Paige. If unemployed workers quit looking for a job and become discouraged workers than they drop out of the unemployment rate figure. The unemployment rate is only calculated by the labour force and people wishing to join the labour force, so people who do not look for jobs aren’t tallied.
@trunthepaige - I know I may be ignorant on this matter, I just can’t understand why those who make a lot of profit, how can they feel so strongly that their money is being taken away. Anyways, I have a better idea regarding taxes. How about we use the republican tax interest rate for the top ten percent, and if any of those companies wish to give the government more money, they should get to choose where that money goes. If no company that makes tons of money wants to give extra money to the government, then, the government must obey this will. The government may be stealing from the rich, but notice that the most successful government in the history of mankind is the government of the united states, and our government is not even that good, it works against us a lot of times, so imagine if we would have a decent government, we would not only be the most successful country in the history of mankind, which we already are, we would also be a prosperous nation without the guilt of having a government loiter money around. God bless you trun.
@SolidStateTheory - No I not wrong your issue is that you they have a group that is not simply discouraged the government says they no longer exist at all. If you believe that these people are actually gone or that the official discouraged workers category really is made up of those who are no longer looking you well your not thinking at all. After 99 week the government loses it ability to track if a person is looking for a job or not
@RulerofMasons - Because it is their money and no one elses. By world standards you are in the top 1% and wealthy. If the world could vote they very well might take all you have.
I want to add that, if I had a company that generated billions in profit, I would not feel ashamed to give more. I think that paying the government money and giving to charity may be two whole different things, and in this sense, I totally agree with you.
@SolidStateTheory - They drop those figures with a Democratic president. (They were included under Bush.)
@RulerofMasons - As she has pointed out, the wealthy in this country pay the majority of our taxes.If you would like I can show you a breakdown….Here, luv: http://www.heritage.org/federalbudget/top10-percent-income-earners
@trunthepaige - Dug your post (and you’ve got boobs, too!)
@Kellsbella - Like Trun said, by world standards I am a very wealthy man : ) The difference is my taxes do not hold the weight of the world, like you just pointed out, the wealthy are carrying us. But I’m not really into rich worship, and with that kind of mentality, LET THE ZOMBIE APOCALYPSE begin!!!! Get money, get money! Do you know why there never will be a zombie apocalypse? Do you know why crimes are only implemented by less than one percent of the population? Do you know why the chinese masses just don’t all get attack us at will? Isn’t it strange that our government protects it’s citizens with welfare and stuff. Do you think the government is compassionate, or is money being used to bribe the masses into not objecting? Or perhaps those who pass laws in Congress have values? I really don’t get why people like you worship the rich, and why others hate them. I have personally spoken to, and used to work for the owner of a many million dollars in profit company, and he was the nastiest guy, all he did was hire hispanics without papers and treat them like how ever he wanted to. Oh yeah, the rich are so noble, and the money they make is so pure and honest. You need to wake up. Being rich is nothing to be proud about. If all you want is more money, if all your eyes can see is money, you are already dead.
I often use the word, “hallucination” and the phrase, “alternative reality” to describe the liberal “thought” process.
@SolidStateTheory - Right. And if you shit in the woods it means you don’t have a flush toilet.
Really now fewer rich folks is basically a clue. When a few folks have a sort of monopoly, the faster they can get rich.
If Apple didn’t have a good sort of “monopoly” wouldn’t they be even more rich?
Why have people forgotten the lessons about trust busting?@mtngirlsouth - Liberal logic? Such a g-d broad term, as if conservative logic could be boiled down into a simple phrase. Liberals like me use history and previous experiments to decide whether or not some ideas are workable. I am definitely against the idea of trickle down economy and I dare you to defend it in a whole blog. If you so desire to accept my challenge, I would write against trickle down economics.@trunthepaige - Exageration serves you well but I do not think you understand what taxing the “rich” really means. When a person hoards money and sends it to off shore places like Caymen Islands and Switzerlan that money is not doing the United States any good. I would endorse rules to stop tax cheaters sending money away from the United States. Some rich people use their money to figure out ways to cheat not giving US money that normally would get taxed.
Even the top 2% have figured out ways to cheat the IRS. However there are some tax breaks that do work, we can’t destroy all the tax breaks.
I suppose people will smile that if Rommey and Ryan gets elected Rommey will pay even less money than he paid in taxes last year. His family will thank you, however even looking at the Income tax form that Rommey pays is the type of 1% people you want to “save. “ Ironically Obama also falls in the 1% and has paid way more than Rommey.
Are billionaires or millionaires more dangerous than middle class folks? I suppose you are happy how some of the billionaires have spent on super pacs? Basically the super rich might be able to shut down the voice of the middle class.
@PPhilip - “Liberals like me use history and previous experiments to decide whether or not some ideas are workable.” - Thanks for the good laugh. I really needed it. I don’t have the time or the inclination to write a blog defending what I know. The quoted sentence from you shows me it would do no good anyway. Don’t expect any further response from me, and feel free to believe that it is because you frightened me away and confused my tiny mind. Have a nice life.
@PPhilip - You want me to defend the the idea that you can only increase taxes so much until you start to lose tax revues due to a decrease in economic activity? Do I really need to defend a fact? Every every major tax rate decrease has been followed by a revue increase. That is called history, a subject I have never seen that liberals know well at all. So your solution to an economic downturn is to increase taxes? And spend more money just like Obama did to dismal results. That is called very short term history, I figured your memory goes back that far.
So can you show were raising taxes ever improved an economy?
I don’t think that Xanga is a place where you can sway someones opinion using facts. I agree with everything you said, but only because I already agreed before I read your post.
So are we arguing that the Bush tax breaks improved the economy? Say the period between 2004 to 2008?
But the high taxes during Clinton’s term was during a time of a normal economy. Are you saying that the taxes contributed to the recession that began during GW Bush?
Do not put me in a corner that I am wanting exhorbitant taxes. I certainly do not advocate killing the goose that lays the golden egg, However obscene profits is the point of my wanting taxes.
Average person’s income (middle class) dropped. The 1% grew and doubled. Shouldn’t they be limited to 50% increase instead of 100%?
@justfinethanku - What? Are you that cynical? Am I that ignorant of facts? Oh wait some of your blogs are just devoid of facts and that just proves what you are. Going by feelings is not trustworthy, try to phrase your statement again..if possible use examples like me for instance.
@trunthepaige -For instance you are using the 4.9 million people number. The current unemployment number is 1.4 million ( http://blogcritics.org/politics/article/number-of-unemployed-americans-soars-over/ )
You like the larger number, and your source? 1.4 vs 4.9 the exaggeration isnt it nothing to sneeze at?
They pay 71% of taxes because they control (if memory serves) 76 percent of the wealth. The bottom 80% control only a few percent of the money in the country. You want to tax them instead?
It’s also worth mentioning that you literally espouse in the second half of the blog the exact same logic you denounce in the first half.
@trunthepaige - Would you agree that cutting spending would worsen the recession as well, or are you going to be partisan and selective?
@justfinethanku - true
@PPhilip - Dude that number is not the unemployment rate it the number of workers who have dropped out of the work force. They are simply gone
@agnophilo - No I would not as increasing it dramatically had no positive benefit. Unless we are talking about the economy of the DC area. They are doing great. Shifting more of this nation GDP from the private to the unproductive public sector is a pathway to stagnation. My point is we can not tax ourselves out of this. It simply will not work. And it is fundamentally unfair to try and balance a budget on 10% of the population that already pays the most both in the amount of taxes and as a percentage of their income.
@PPhilip - Stupid argument yes they did but If I give this one to you all you have done is cherry picked a single exception and not even tried to prove that tax increases have a positive effect. Thinking that increasing taxes improves an economy makes you rather unusual about zero economists believe that. And about the rich getting richer sorry they lost more as a percentage and most http://www.cnbc.com/id/48257611/The_Falling_Fortunes_of_the_One_Percent
So your argument is based on a lie. I am not calling you a lair as i am sure you believed the lie was true
@trunthepaige - Okay so you are being selective, dishonest and partisan. Thanks for letting me know.
@trunthepaige - Whether or not they dropped out or they are unhappy do they matter? Will they form a riot or just behave and stay silent.
Basically we have a million and a half citizens who are actively looking for work. Of that group maybe some are just pretending to look for work or maybe they want just jobs that will meet their needs.
Meeting their needs is a bit difficult. Some employers would rather not pay them much. We can blame the Chinese for the loss of high paying jobs, certainly because the rich are getting richer must mean that exploiting working folks could be part of that reason.
So we go in a round about sort of fact sharing. I am around 60 and I certainly know I can’t get a full weeks worth of work. The baby boomers not working full time must be part of the missing 3 million that are missing. I am not unhappy but it seems to me someone is hoarding money and not wanting to spend. Exactly why trickle down economy is not working.
@agnophilo - Far from it I’m pointing out that increased spending failed to work. I do admit that unthoughtful slashing would be a bad idea. But we just tried pouring money into an economy only to prove it a failure.
@PPhilip - My subject is that the current economic polices of this administrations are a failure and the realities of the mess are even worse than these very bad numbers. And still despite my proving that the rich are losing money in this mess at a greater rate than the rest of us that they are not making more money. you still want to play the hate the rich game. You are sort of all over the place and not addressing the subjects.
Please you seem to have something to say. I want to let you say it. Do not worry about responding to my other questions.
What do you think needs to be done?
@agnophilo - I ot sure if I got snotty to you but if I did I seem to be int ha sort of mood so i am sorry I am and will be more careful
@PPhilip - I pretty sure i was a snot to you here. I am sorry and will stop doing that now
The key to increasing taxes is to increase wages. So the government needs to create an environment that is friendly to job growth. President Obama should forget everything he is working on and focus on creating an environment that is friendly toward business and growth.
@TheTheologiansCafe - He really thought that he was. By increasing government he is not a fan of private business. To him its all about the goverment
@trunthepaige - Wow, thank you for apologizing.
And both raising taxes and cutting spending stimulate the economy less, but giving tax cuts to the wealthy doesn’t solve the problem of high unemployment, because the rich don’t hire more people the more money they have, they hire more people the more demand there is for their products and services. Putting money in the hands of the poor that spend every dime they get to get by creates the most demand. Supply side economics is just lopsided, you can’t bolster the investment class enough to make up for people not having enough money to buy things. As someone said at a TED talk, there aren’t enough rich people to power a great economy because while he (the speaker) makes a few hundred or a few thousand times the average income, he doesn’t buy a few thousand pairs of pants or drive a few thousand cars or eat out a few thousand times a month. Giving to the rich doesn’t stimulate the economy, at least not by itself.
Imagine you’re bill o’reilly. You make ten million a year and you think it sucks that you have to pay a big chunk of that in taxes. But imagine if that money went to a works program and got millions of people working again, or any of a dozen programs to lessen poverty and strengthen the middle class – your taxes might not go down any, but a lot more people will be able to afford cable, and more viewers = more money. The poor and middle class are the grass on which businessmen graze – pouring a little water on them every so often isn’t a bad thing for anyone.
@TheTheologiansCafe - See the above comment.
If I was Mitt Rommey I would want people to think the Obama Administration was a failure. If I was Obama I would try to show how the policies of GW Bush caused the recession. Aren’t they the motives of politicians?
I am an American. I want America to provide good paying jobs isn’t that the creed of Unions?
I am not rich but since I am Chinese American I know that a lot of the Chinese Americans do make money and can be wealthy. Jews and Chinese have been hated for having money and at times they get their money taken from them. I would not like to see a repeat of that but when the gap between rich and poor get too great, don’t you think that the rich deserve some of the fates that happened to them?
@trunthepaige - Ha, ha, you said I hate the rich….I like an orderly society and don’t think a big gap in wealth is healthy. I do like your change in attitude. (Where’s Lo Borne? at least at times he recs my blogs. If people are totally snotty they would never change or give chances.)
Maybe I should read about the hidden unemployed, or maybe they are a hidden group of people just being used as an excuse for reasons unknown? Wondering minds want to know.
@justfinethanku - Nicely done.
@justfinethanku - Liberals are liberals because somebody got to them before reality could be explained to them. It is the job of every person with authentic American pedigree to continually make the argument for America.
Clarity is the objective, not agreement.
People who seek agreement are being egotistical. People who seek clarity are being wise.
@agnophilo - The government cannot stimulate economic growth. It’s impossible.
That’s because the government has no assets of its own.
To have assets to spread around, the government must first extract them from the people who create wealth or from people who are the recipients of wealth created by wealth producers.
Wealth is produced by labor, capital and ideas in the free market. Taxation depletes wealth-producing capital, thus depressing economic growth. Consequently, government “stimulus” actually lowers the standard of living if any nation that tries it.
Therefore, any nation that wants the highest possible standard of living will have the smallest government possible so as to maintain the law and order necessary for free markets to function smoothly.
Your economic philosophy is Marxist, which was proven to be a total failure decades ago.
just can’t get by the fact that little people(comparative income wise) have such an issue with the big people paying a bit more in taxes. there is absolutely no reason this shouldn’t happen. yes, you’re right. if they don’t have to pay it, we will, eventually.
@RulerofMasons - Your suggestion of the government bribing the masses might be the most profound truth expressed here today.
@Aloysius_son - I disagree, I love how Trun expresses her views, and she is very consistent with her ideas, which means, she has enough integrity to be trusted, and it’s not her fault that her commentators have no clue what they are talking about. As for the bribe thing, I really couldn’t tell if you were being sarcastic, or you really believe in that wood.
@RulerofMasons - In as much as I enjoy employing sarcasm, in this instance I must admit that I do believe our elected officials deliberately employ programs to placate the masses, to keep them under control. It isn’t necessarily a bad thing, but when not properly crafted these programs contribute to many sociatal deficiencies.
@Aloysius_son - I disagree, i mean, I am wary of that. The government has no need to placate the poor. Like I said, it’s all about human behavior, there is nothing in the world that can cause a massive outbreak here in the States, or anywhere in the world. We are not bees or fungus connected to each other by a hive, we are independent selfish sex lovers and pleasure fiends. And although mass shootings confirm that there is a lot of anxiety in our culture, it will never be enough or reach a boiling point, because most humans have strong enough self defense mechanisms to tolerate pain, and god awful situations, like mines, which is, to never experience the touch of a woman.
@RulerofMasons - I admire your optimism in spite of the interlacings of cynicism. I don’t disagree, but I am inclined to examine the sphere from multiple angles. While it is true that members of our government employ many tactics to maintain social order, it is not soley to placate one particular group of people, although that is taken into consideration. The essence of our government is that we the people strive to instill in our collective consciousness, a sense of duty and obligation, to provide for the general defense and welfare of all our citizens, regardless of class, race, faith, social stature, age or gender. We as a nation have attempted and will continue to try to provide these by every reasonable means necessary.
Unfortunately there are many perceived flaws in every aspect of humanity, which come under the scrutiny of our citizenry. It is in examining these flaws that we often bump heads with those of other points of views. With so many varying perspectives, conflicts arise particularly while we search for solutions. Many social programs employed today need to be reexamined and honed, to be more effective. Some need to be cut while new ones are developed.
Restructuring taxation, redistribution of wealth, providing opportunities through public works projects and assistance programs are all well intended and beneficial efforts. We need to remain diligent in our monitoring of these efforts to be certain that we do not succumb to chaos, misuse, misappropriation or self destruction, which historically has been proven to occur.
I do not mind paying taxes perse, but I dispise it when I see those tax dollars wasted in what appears to be frivolity, mismanagement or dishonesty. Calling attention to these abuses early, hopefully will curtail the action and provide us with greater social benefits.
@Aloysius_son - Corruption is incurable, any efforts to stop it can result in more corruption, it is the dishonesty and lies that makes life worth living. To live a truthful life would be the same as putting everyone in a mental institution. Truth and honesty would destroy the world sooner than all the corruption that has ever existed combined. What you need to ask yourself sir is, “how are you able to tolerate an existence” that is honest and true? How is it that there are people out there who don’t succumb to the chaos? The answer is very simple mr sir, it is not because you are good, it is because… sorry to change the subject, but I believe all men are dishonest. What you are complaining about is a simple matter of, why should our government or anyone show mercy and kindness and genorocity in the first place? It’s not like you said, if things would go according to plan, the rich would never feed a dime, and so I hope you have a plan on what to do with the many starving. Perhaps guns were created to kill those who starve. Either way, it is a sick thing to contemplate, and I am both disgusted by the shooters, and the looters.
“If we tax the top 10% of the US population at a rate of 100% and take all they own. We can not only reduce the deficit to zero but we can also pay off the entire national dept. But enjoy that one year because you just bankrupted the people who pay 71% of all taxes. It will be a great one year but the government will need to cut itself by 2/3 after that.”
an allowable sacrifice.that is a great way to start over.
@RulerofMasons - All men are dishonest, and all men are honest, each to a degree. Which is a more admirable a trait to posses? I tend to admire and desire to surround myself with those of a more honest nature than those of a dishonest nature. Honesty is a trait that can be taught, using classical teaching strategies.
Can we however remain true to our own selves?
I don’t suppose you listen to the Dead Kennedys
@agnophilo - No response to this?
@agnophilo - I have so not been arround